Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[lotacus]

From a argumentative point of view that's not completely valid and factual. If you believe it's a fundamental issue (which from Lycan's words and experience with RMA'd devices it apparently isn't) you assume that there a tons of people who do not reported a seriously malfunctioning device. That sounds more like wishful thinking. The forum is not the only source (it's just the least reliable source IMHO): retailers get all the RMA requests which do not go through the forum but directly to Dlink labs. And if you participate on a forum: there's only questions and issues/problems on these boards, nobody goes to a forum to praise a product they just bought.

Your starting point is that there really is a serious issue but the numbers don't add up to that. It's like believing in extraterrestrial live. There are there but we just haven't seen them yet 

Your doing a lot of assuming. You should ask for clarification first and yes, my statement is very valid and true.

[jason1722x]

Lets say D-link sells 100000, units a year. Then take that an times it by the products lifetime of 2+ years.

Now look at the volume of failures that are specific to this ( not including hardware failure or misuse that results in a replacement that corrects the issue) and I can assure you that it's >1%.

Again, I'm not trying to in anyway discount the failures you guys are having, I'm simply trying to help everyone keep this in perspective.

We are working to correct this as quickly as possible.
 Forums and Customer Service is where people go when there are problems with their products, this can make the issue seem much worse then it actually is on a global scale.

Just a little FYI.

That being said, I'm working with the PM team to resolve any issues with this unit esp. the ones with shareport.

Just curious since you are talking numbers. How many actually downloaded from Dlinks ftp fw1.31? I'm sure you can find that out easy enough.
I bet the numbers will also show the amount of traffic to the forum has greatly increased, along with customer service calls.
 Also since fw1.31NA is only for North America if I'm not mistaken then a recalculation may be in order. How many of 100,000 were North America routers that could have upgraded?
A global scale? You want global scale then release it globally!
I bet the numbers wouldn't be >1% then.

[mackworth]

Lets say D-link sells 100000, units a year. Then take that an times it by the products lifetime of 2+ years.

Now look at the volume of failures that are specific to this ( not including hardware failure or misuse that results in a replacement that corrects the issue) and I can assure you that it's >1%.

Again, I'm not trying to in anyway discount the failures you guys are having, I'm simply trying to help everyone keep this in perspective.

We are working to correct this as quickly as possible.
 Forums and Customer Service is where people go when there are problems with their products, this can make the issue seem much worse then it actaully is on a global scale.

Just a little FYI.

That being said, I'm working with the PM team to resolve any issues with this unit esp. the ones with shareport.

Besides all the other issues people have brought up with your argument, such as how many people have actually installed 1.31, etc, dlink still hasn't explained how this can be hardware related when this problem arrived in a firmware that fixed the feature causing the freezes, along with how this is showing up on multiple products on the their latest firmwares. 

[PeterJvM]

So you're actually saying that it is more than 1 %.

Lets say D-link sells 100000, units a year. Then take that an times it by the products lifetime of 2+ years.

Now look at the volume of failures that are specific to this ( not including hardware failure or misuse that results in a replacement that corrects the issue) and I can assure you that it's >1%.

Again, I'm not trying to in anyway discount the failures you guys are having, I'm simply trying to help everyone keep this in perspective.

We are working to correct this as quickly as possible.
 Forums and Customer Service is where people go when there are problems with their products, this can make the issue seem much worse then it actaully is on a global scale.

Just a little FYI.

That being said, I'm working with the PM team to resolve any issues with this unit esp. the ones with shareport.

[Demonized]

I guess there's a typo from Lycan?

@Mackworth: The question you're are asking (how many this, if, else etc) are effective in debating meetings in which you want to discredit the other party. 

The math is valid (taking the > -typo into account), assuming that there should be more is purely....an assumption, not substantiated. If people complain there is an issue. If people don't complain there is no issue, simple as that. Everything in this world will become a problem when you come up with al kinds of hypothetical situations.

I am a corporate guy and I understand perfectly that Dlink isn't obliged (and perhaps not willing too) to disclose all the nasty details about their equipment. I know everybody wants (or claims to be entitled to) complete transparency, but from a PR PoV this is not a wise thing to do.
Dlink should provide you with a solution and they are working on that.

And before you'll call me a Dlink fanboy or whatever: I really don't care about Dlink. It's just a router...

[Lycan]

I <3 Typos.

[mackworth]

I guess there's a typo from Lycan?

@Mackworth: The question you're are asking (how many this, if, else etc) are effective in debating meetings in which you want to discredit the other party. 

The math is valid (taking the > -typo into account), assuming that there should be more is purely....an assumption, not substantiated. If people complain there is an issue. If people don't complain there is no issue, simple as that. Everything in this world will become a problem when you come up with al kinds of hypothetical situations.

I am a corporate guy and I understand perfectly that Dlink isn't obliged (and perhaps not willing too) to disclose all the nasty details about their equipment. I know everybody wants (or claims to be entitled to) complete transparency, but from a PR PoV this is not a wise thing to do.
Dlink should provide you with a solution and they are working on that.

And before you'll call me a Dlink fanboy or whatever: I really don't care about Dlink. It's just a router...

Right, I understand dlink can't provide that information, and I don't expect them too.  But If Lycan is going to make that argument he should back it up.  It doesn't need to tell us the numbers, but if he said, "I looked at the number of individuals that have downloaded 1.31 and compared it to the increase in forum registrations/posts and call complaints and found that the number of complaints is less than 1%" people wouldn't be asking him those questions.

And in terms of providing a solution, so far D-Link hasn't even provided a light at the end of the tunnel.  Lycan has said its not a firmware issue.  So I am not sure what solution you think d-link is going to provide us unless they plan on RMAing all our routers with units running 1.11.

[Demonized]

It's impossible to estimate how many users have 1.11, 1.20, 1.21, 1.30, 1.31 and 1.32. And issues also occur with early firmwares (below 1.3x) and all people use their riouter differently. There are just too many variables to give even en educated guess.

I am one of the lucky guys having a hassle free router it seems. My gut feeling is that there is a batch of routers that suffer from production errors (there a a lot of new parts used in newer revisions of the DIR)  No, I cannot back this up (=> gut feeling). But that would also  explain the 'lack' of communication 

[lotacus]

well if that's the case, then it's safe to say that we would be able to confirm that with serial number to determine the batch run that's been affected.

[mackworth]

It's impossible to estimate how many users have 1.11, 1.20, 1.21, 1.30, 1.31 and 1.32. And issues also occur with early firmwares (below 1.3x) and all people use their riouter differently. There are just too many variables to give even en educated guess.

EXACTLY THE POINT!  You just proved my point.  Lycan is arguing the rate of calls and returns is low.  But you are saying its impossible to estimate how many users run 1.11, etc.  He used his argument to claim that its not a firmware issue.  If your argument above his true, you just invalidated his argument.

[jason1722x]

Blah blah blah...all I know is Dlink released a firmware with the intent of making my Dlink router better and I installed it with that understanding.
Lets face it most would not be here if there wasn't a problem.

[Demonized]

EXACTLY THE POINT!  You just proved my point.  Lycan is arguing the rate of calls and returns is low.  But you are saying its impossible to estimate how many users run 1.11, etc.  He used his argument to claim that its not a firmware issue.  If your argument above his true, you just invalidated his argument.

Nice try. You're using my words in a different context. It's a respone on

but if he said, "I looked at the number of individuals that have downloaded 1.31 and compared it to the increase in forum registrations/posts and call complaints and found that the number of complaints is less than 1%"

Shame on you. 

Lycan knows how many (absolute figures) returns have come in, and also which firmware that is on them. So if there were any anomalies specifically on 1.3x level he would know (and tell).

He also stated that (very many of)the devices returned/RMA-ed do not show the issues in the Dlink lab....That's funny, right?

[Demonized]

well if that's the case, then it's safe to say that we would be able to confirm that with serial number to determine the batch run that's been affected.

In it's most simple form...yes. U 8)nless they don't know (yet) where the problem originates from

[mackworth]

Nice try. You're using my words in a different context. It's a respone on Shame on you. 

Lycan knows how many (absolute figures) returns have come in, and also which firmware that is on them. So if there were any anomalies specifically on 1.3x level he would know (and tell).

He also stated that (very many of)the devices returned/RMA-ed do not show the issues in the Dlink lab....That's funny, right?

All I am saying is that just because an issue can't reproduced, doesn't mean its not an issue.  I work  with some of the largest retailers in the world, and sometimes I can't reproduce their issues.  I make educated guesses at what the issue might be, and my code changes work.  We have a firmware release that has caused users to run into an issue where it didn't before.  The issue is happening over different product lines.  The issue is happening with a feature that was "fixed" in the firmware that's causing the problem.  No one has explained that.

[lotacus]

Right. Ok, it takes 4 to 5 days for the issue to appear. I really don't believe dlink would spend those resources trying to reproduce the problem. sorry. I dont buy it. I also don't buy that the routers are RMA'd due to that problem. If by chance 1 got through, Dlink would simply plug the router in to a 30 second test, and deem it ok, and sell it as refurbished. That's reality in the corporate world.