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Author Topic: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking  (Read 8129 times)

KernelSoftware

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #15 on: November 21, 2015, 03:24:07 PM »

FurryNutz, I do understand all of what you said.  The Charter modem/router is in bridge mode and does provide a public IP address to the DIR router.  We don't use a Class A network on the DIR router due to the ISP; the customer's network is using a Class A network.  Yes, the default addressing (192.168.0.x) works fine, but does not meet the customer requirement.  Using a Class A network on previous versions of DIR routers (eg, DIR-655) worked fine with the exact same settings, ISP, and ISP modem/router.  This has only been an issue starting with the DIR-850L we've been testing.

Also, I apologize for the misstatement above.  The DSR routers are not going away; the DFL routers are going away.

Our D-Link rep stated the DFL routers were the only D-Link routers to support Class A networks, despite the fact that Class A networks have worked on previous models of DIR routers.  There is nothing in the DIR settings, specs, or documentation stating Class A networks cannot be used and the router does not prohibit entering Class A settings.  Other brands of routers restrict owners to Class C networks within the router's settings.  D-Link does not.  So, this is either implied support for Class A networks or poor firmware coding.

Hard Harry, I understood what you meant.  A tracert shows the first 7 hops to be in the 96.x.x.x range and none in the 10.x.x.x range overall.  Also, if this was not the case, it shouldn't work with the older routers (DIR-655) either, but it works fine.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2015, 03:28:43 PM by KernelSoftware »
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FurryNutz

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #16 on: November 21, 2015, 03:37:45 PM »

The support in the 655 may have been a unknown added feature on older home class routers and it may have been removed on newer generation routers. All I can say is that D-Link told me that class A is not supported on there home class routers. So you may want to research and review DSR series business routers for any future Class A configurations needs. Good Luck.
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Cable: 1Gb/50Mb>NetGear CAX80>DIR-882>HP 24pt Gb Switch. COVR-1202/2202/3902,DIR-2660/80,3xDGL-4500s,DIR-857,835,827,815,890L,880L,868L,836L,810L,685,657,3x655s,645,628,601,DNR-202L,DNS-345,DCS-933L,936L,960L and 8000LH.

KernelSoftware

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #17 on: November 21, 2015, 03:46:31 PM »

Yeah, I got the same story without further explanation.  They state that now, but nowhere in the documentation or settings that I could find.  Our D-Link rep also stated Class A networks are not supported on their DSR series either, only the end-of-life DFL routers.  Port redirection is also a requirement and I've found support only on D-Link and Draytek routers, so far (not Cisco, Netgear, ZyXEL, etc).
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FurryNutz

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #18 on: November 21, 2015, 03:58:33 PM »

Only explanation I can think if is that there may have not been class standards between home and business routers or firewall appliance devices back then. I can only surmised that as standards were reviewed over the years at D-Link, marketing and or standards caused a change in what was coded in all home class routers and logically thinking, no much call for class A configurations in the consumer home environment so they may have figured that why included it when it's not being used. Any usually networking standards has never been in any router Mfr support documentation other than on the web and networking sites noting that is handed down by the certification and standards people.

I might suggest maybe checking out the DIR-868L or 866L model routers. These are the last of the old UI thats like the DIR-655 and may still have some additional features maybe. Other than this. If DSR series don't support Class A then, try HP Enterprise and see if they might have anything. Possible that Enterprise products maybe worth reviewing. It's just that Class A is meant for enterprise close high end business systems, not a lot of use for mom and pop on the home front.  :-\
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Cable: 1Gb/50Mb>NetGear CAX80>DIR-882>HP 24pt Gb Switch. COVR-1202/2202/3902,DIR-2660/80,3xDGL-4500s,DIR-857,835,827,815,890L,880L,868L,836L,810L,685,657,3x655s,645,628,601,DNR-202L,DNS-345,DCS-933L,936L,960L and 8000LH.

KernelSoftware

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2015, 12:30:41 PM »

Thanks FurryNutz.  However, I disagree with this statement: "Any usually networking standards has never been in any router Mfr support documentation other than on the web and networking sites noting that is handed down by the certification and standards people."  Other manufacturers make lack of Class A network support obvious in their firmware; they don't allow you to set the subnet mask to anything other than 255.255.255.0.  The D-Link firmware allows you to set any values in IP address and subnet mask.  You only find out there's an issue when it doesn't work; there are no warnings, errors, or alerts.  And, it does actually work with some modems and it does work with wireless clients.  Only wired clients when using some modems are affected.  That makes the issue appear as if it was a bug in firmware rather than a company policy to not support Class A networks, regardless of the actual intent.
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FurryNutz

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #20 on: November 23, 2015, 03:41:45 PM »


Well maybe however it comes down to what network standards say and are applicable too. A is for big business and enterprise, C is for the home. I presume router Mfrs just may to choose to state this in any support documentation due to these known specs. Would be up to Mfr to put that in or know I guess. Ya, would be nice however again, probably boils down to usage by that masses. Each Mfr does there own thing.  I would presume that it would be up to users to review and research this information prior to making any purchases. Assuming that each router is the same prior or follow on would not be wise.
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Cable: 1Gb/50Mb>NetGear CAX80>DIR-882>HP 24pt Gb Switch. COVR-1202/2202/3902,DIR-2660/80,3xDGL-4500s,DIR-857,835,827,815,890L,880L,868L,836L,810L,685,657,3x655s,645,628,601,DNR-202L,DNS-345,DCS-933L,936L,960L and 8000LH.

KernelSoftware

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #21 on: November 23, 2015, 05:03:13 PM »

Early versions of Microsoft Small Business Server defaulted to Class A network settings during setup.  That's software specifically designed for small business with a limited number of users.  So, lots of small businesses started out as Class A networks and continue to use ithem today.  Since D-Link SMB routers used to support Class A networking, it must not have been a big issue to do so.  Too bad it decided against continuing that tradition.  The change just doesn't make any sense to me.
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FurryNutz

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #22 on: November 24, 2015, 12:26:40 PM »

Understandable...well again, may have been that for home use, they chose to take it out or not include it in newer stuff. Again, were taking home vs business. Comes down to testing and money. Why spend money and time/development, and testing features when they are mostly not going to be used by the avg home user.
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Cable: 1Gb/50Mb>NetGear CAX80>DIR-882>HP 24pt Gb Switch. COVR-1202/2202/3902,DIR-2660/80,3xDGL-4500s,DIR-857,835,827,815,890L,880L,868L,836L,810L,685,657,3x655s,645,628,601,DNR-202L,DNS-345,DCS-933L,936L,960L and 8000LH.

KernelSoftware

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #23 on: November 24, 2015, 12:55:13 PM »

Yeah, that's one of my points exactly.  Most of the features in the DIR series routers are not going to be used by typical home users.  So, why are they there in the first place?  Until the lack of Class A support appeared, I thought D-Link was underselling these products.  They could easily be used by SMB customers.  Now, not so much.
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FurryNutz

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #24 on: November 24, 2015, 02:51:34 PM »

Who knows. You'll have to find something that does work for your needs. Good Luck.
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Cable: 1Gb/50Mb>NetGear CAX80>DIR-882>HP 24pt Gb Switch. COVR-1202/2202/3902,DIR-2660/80,3xDGL-4500s,DIR-857,835,827,815,890L,880L,868L,836L,810L,685,657,3x655s,645,628,601,DNR-202L,DNS-345,DCS-933L,936L,960L and 8000LH.

KernelSoftware

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #25 on: November 24, 2015, 10:06:35 PM »

Yeah, I found that the DrayTek Vigor2925ac supports port redirection and Class A networks, as long as you do not use the router's internal DHCP server.  However, that works out fine, since customers using Class A networks all use a domain-base DHCP server anyway.  Thank you for all your efforts.
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FurryNutz

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Re: DIR-850L wired clients cannot use Class A networking
« Reply #26 on: November 25, 2015, 10:03:40 AM »

The the DIR-850L would support Class A if you disabled the DHCP server in you case then.

Good Luck in your endeavours.  ;)
« Last Edit: January 28, 2016, 10:27:09 AM by FurryNutz »
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Cable: 1Gb/50Mb>NetGear CAX80>DIR-882>HP 24pt Gb Switch. COVR-1202/2202/3902,DIR-2660/80,3xDGL-4500s,DIR-857,835,827,815,890L,880L,868L,836L,810L,685,657,3x655s,645,628,601,DNR-202L,DNS-345,DCS-933L,936L,960L and 8000LH.
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