D-Link Forums
The Graveyard - Products No Longer Supported => Routers / COVR => DIR-655 => Topic started by: dbtrader1 on June 29, 2009, 09:55:27 AM
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My Mac mini is getting horrible wireless speeds with my DLink 655. If I put one of my PCs in the exact same location I get about 18mbps download speeds. My Mac mini gets about 200kbps. What is odd is the upload speed for the mini is about the same as the PCs which is 7mbps. I have a feeling the dlink and apple aren't playing nice together for some reason. Does anyone know of a setting on the Mac or dlink that can fix this?
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One more thing. It looks like the Mac Mini will only connect at "G". This issue has caused me to lose what little hair I have left on my head. Any help is greatly apprecited.
Thanks,
Dan
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In your network Utility Application, can you post a screenshot of your info tab with your wireless connection selected? What version mac mini? What version OS?
Also, what settings are you using for wireless on the router.
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Thanks for the reply: Here is what I have at hand. W
MB463LL/A (newest Mac Mini)
Mac OS X (10.5.7)
Wireless Settings:
Mode: n and g
channel: 11
transmission rate: automatic
channel width: 20/40
Security: WPA
Do you mean the network utility application on the Mac?
Thanks,
Dan
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Thanks for the reply: Here is what I have at hand. W
MB463LL/A (newest Mac Mini)
Mac OS X (10.5.7)
Wireless Settings:
Mode: n and g
channel: 11
transmission rate: automatic
channel width: 20/40
Security: WPA
Do you mean the network utility application on the Mac?
Thanks,
Dan
Yeah, I was talking about on your mac. Don't actually need the screen shot, I am just wondering what the "link speed" is.
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I have never used that utility but was able to find it with search. I'm a bit surprised apple support never asked me to pull that up. In any case it says 130mps so that looks good. Any suggestions is much appreciated.
Dan
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I had a quick thought, I read somewhere that the channel width selection under the manual wireless settings area was put there specifically for Intel wireless N network cards (those cards only support 130 mbps anyways)... I see your channel width is set to auto 20/40, I wonder if that causes the issue you're having? Try changing that setting to 20 MHz only. Again, this is just a thought, but that setting is there for a reason :)
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The wireless performance in general is horrible - period. Its not that they don't play nice together, as it's more so software.
The 20/40 channel width is necessary for "N" speeds, however if you drop it to 20 Hz, you'd ultimately lose that ability. Sure, it'll still broadcast at N, but at really really gimped speeds.
Try forcing it to "N" mode only, with WPA2 Personal, and a cipher type of AES.
I've noticed on both my 4500 and DIR-655 that the wireless N speeds have been really really bad in general. And again, as I mentioned earlier, it's not hardware - it's software. Sadly to say, it's more so on D-Link's side.
Although you may have a link speed of 130 Mbps, you could try just forcing it to "G", and see how stable it is. It might be better, it might not.
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I had a quick thought, I read somewhere that the channel width selection under the manual wireless settings area was put there specifically for Intel wireless N network cards (those cards only support 130 mbps anyways)... I see your channel width is set to auto 20/40, I wonder if that causes the issue you're having? Try changing that setting to 20 MHz only. Again, this is just a thought, but that setting is there for a reason :)
I am not sure the new mini's use intel adapters. I thought they used broadcom cards but I could be wrong.
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I thought N speeds were better if the router were set to 20-only rather than 20/40.
Can somebody clear this up?
I have had good wireless N speeds in general set to 20-only--but with an occasional daily slow-down happening that I attributed to OpenDNS--which is having a lot of issues with mis-categorization of sites. Maybe this 20-40 thing is at issue?
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Well, I'm about ready to toss this router out the window and go buy something else. It's clearly a software issue. If I change the WISH settings and give my Mac Mini highest priority (Voice High) I can get about 6mb download and 8mb upload. That said, my PC will still pull about 20mb download and 8mb upload in the exact same location. To me this is absurd. I've never had these kind of issues with any other routers I've owned. Since this is a Dlink sponsored forum I would love to hear what a moderator or SME has to say about the incompatibility with Macs.
Thanks,
Dan
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Here's the thing.... I'm not positive the Mac Mini has an Intel wireless adapter, however, the chipset on the the motherboard is an Intel chipset (I'm talking northbridge and southbridge not wireless chipsets). The wireless N spec itself lists 40 MHz wide channels as a standard, but this does not work properly with some devices, in fact, Intel wireless N cards have the 'Channel Width' spec defaulted to 20 MHz only. Now, as for this being a D-Link only issue, it seems like this is more of a Mac only issue... I can almost guarantee you this is a Mac OS driver issue. One of the things that tipped me off in the original poster's message (it being a possible Intel issue), is the 130 mbps connection speed. When wireless N was first released, 20 MHz channel widths were the default, an as such were limited to 130 mbps (still wireless N because of the MIMO feature), however, the 40 MHz channel width is necessary for 270/300 mbps operation. This sort of seems like a weird auto step-down for the wireless device, unless the driver in Mac OS specifically allows only a 20 MHz channel bonding (this could be hardware or software related actually). There is also a feature, which as far as I know exists on a driver level, and in Windows only, for the wireless network card to broadcast whether or not it's capable of utilizing 20 or 40 MHz channels or both. Again.... this poster has found that the performance is only horrible with his Mac Mini, and doesn't have these issues with his PCs... this leads me to the conclusion that it's a hardware/software issue with the mac only. I've also done a quick search on Google to *try* to find any information on the performance of the wireless device in a Mac Mini and was unable to find anything. Please try setting the channel width on the router to 20 MHz as a possible/probable solution to this issue.
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After seeing this last post, this REALLY leaves me to believe that in fact the wireless card/chipset of the Mac Mini is only capable of 20 MHz channel widths. Still though, the actual performance that dbtrader1 is seeing, is only a small fraction of 130 mbps (assuming the speed he gives is megabits and not megabytes).
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My Airport express which is even farther away gets a decent signal so are you saying it depends on which apple product it is? If I change the setting to 20mhz then all my other devices which were getting up to 300mbps will now max out at 130mbps correct? If that is the case it doesn't sound like a good solution to me.
Dan
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If you are so curious as to what kind of adapter it is, click the Apple logo top left, and select "About This Mac", and hit More Info... Left hand pane, wireless network adapter...it'll tell the manufacturer.
Again, it has NOTHING TO DO WITH LINK SPEED, nor does your link speed have any effect on how fast you will download.
The OP doesn't even mention what his line is rated for. On top of that, you didn't listen to what I had to say regarding the bad firmware, which cripples the wireless performance. The point of telling him to force it to G mode is that G/B seems to be a bit more stable than N.
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To put the wireless card type to rest I checked and it's a Broadcom BCM43XX 1.0. As for my link speed it's a 30meg pipe so that isn't the issue. I did change my settings to WAP2 and AES and the signal strenght is a bit better but no luck on the speed. If I set my router to "N" only what about the clients that have "G" cards? Won't they no longer connect?
Dan
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Alright Reinvented.... there are a couple of points you're missing. First of all, 802.11n DOES NOT MEAN 5 GHz operation. 802.11n has support for both 2.4 and 5.2 GHz operation, however most implementations (and the DIR-655 in specific) only support the 2.4 GHz frequencies. 802.11b/g/n all are 2.4 GHz, 802.11a is 5 GHz, but you can find dual-band routers (DIR-855) and wireless network cards. The device in this person's Mac Mini is in fact a dual-band card, the Airport Extreme cards and Airport Express (802.11n version) are dual-band devices as well. Also, I did not tell this person to switch to G only, wireless N exists in both 20 and 40 MHz wide channels, you should probably do some more research or understand what it is you're talking about before getting this kind of attitude. Oh and by the way, I just found this:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1937911&tstart=135
(The point of this article is that 270 mbps on mac devices is only possible when using dual-band.)
To the person that is trying to find help... Yes, changing the channel width to 20 MHz would mean your other wireless N devices would no longer connect above 130 mbps. If you're getting speeds of anything under 30 mbps (your internet connection speed), something is clearly wrong. Can you please try setting the channel width to 20 MHz from the router? I know this isn't an ideal situation, but it may give you a usable connection from the mini. (You can test LAN and internet performance before and after on PCs and the mac to determine if this will suit your needs.)
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Just to rein this whole thing in minus the rhetoric and to put a solution in the simplest understandable terms:
To possibly achieve better than 130 Mbps, is the consensus expert opinion/suggestion for Macintosh owners to adjust the settings in the DIR-655 as follows in the Manual Wireless Network Setup:
1. Set the Mode to N-Only
2. Enable Auto Channel Scan
3. Set the Transmission Rate to Best (Automatic)
4. Set the Channel Width to Auto 20/40 MHz
5. Set the Security Mode to WPA-Personal
6. Set WPA Mode to WPA2 Only
7. Set Cipher Mode to AES
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Alright Reinvented.... there are a couple of points you're missing. First of all, 802.11n DOES NOT MEAN 5 GHz operation. 802.11n has support for both 2.4 and 5.2 GHz operation, however most implementations (and the DIR-655 in specific) only support the 2.4 GHz frequencies. 802.11b/g/n all are 2.4 GHz, 802.11a is 5 GHz, but you can find dual-band routers (DIR-855) and wireless network cards. The device in this person's Mac Mini is in fact a dual-band card, the Airport Extreme cards and Airport Express (802.11n version) are dual-band devices as well. Also, I did not tell this person to switch to G only, wireless N exists in both 20 and 40 MHz wide channels, you should probably do some more research or understand what it is you're talking about before getting this kind of attitude. Oh and by the way, I just found this:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1937911&tstart=135
(The point of this article is that 270 mbps on mac devices is only possible when using dual-band.)
To the person that is trying to find help... Yes, changing the channel width to 20 MHz would mean your other wireless N devices would no longer connect above 130 mbps. If you're getting speeds of anything under 30 mbps (your internet connection speed), something is clearly wrong. Can you please try setting the channel width to 20 MHz from the router? I know this isn't an ideal situation, but it may give you a usable connection from the mini. (You can test LAN and internet performance before and after on PCs and the mac to determine if this will suit your needs.)
Bud, I mentioned NOTHING about 5 GHz. It's poor firmware on D-Link's side. Learn to read first before you post.
I know the mechanics of HOW it works. What you are failing to understand is that it's not some incompatibility, but again as I mentioned earlier, poor software from D-Link. The fact still remains that regardless of what channel width is set to, he will still have unstable connections on Wireless N. The purpose of me telling him to switch to G, was that I've found 2.4 GHz G, to be more stable, and more consistent. He is getting what I was getting on both my 4500 and 655 using Wireless N. And yes, I have a link speed of 130 Mbps also. However, the router reported back at 52 or so.
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The entire reason for this person's post was to determine the cause of his horrible speeds while under
Mac OS only. Poorly designed firmware has absolutely nothing to do with this issue, and what you're proposing would prevent any connections at wireless N speeds. The fact is to get link speeds higher than 130 mbps on a mac product, you need a dual-band A/N router. Yes, switching to N only, or G only might solve his issues, but his requirement is for all devices to work, G and N alike. In any circumstance his best choice might be to return the 655 for an 855, or just switch to an Apple wireless product.
In most cases I've found that people who call others 'Kid' online, are in fact, children themselves.
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If you want speeds > 130 Mbps you need a NIC that is 20+40 Mhz capable. I don't know if the Mac's have those, but the Intel wireless chipsets support only 20. I think the 5300 does 40 Mhz, but I've heard some pretty terrible storiess about this chipset's connectivity (5100/5300)
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Demonized,
The issue with speeds greater than 130 mbps on mac actually is a limitation of Mac OS. When people boot to Windows using Boot Camp these same macs are capable of 300 mbps. Just wanted to let you know :)
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Thanks...I am not a Mac dude and it shows. ;D
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...The issue with speeds greater than 130 mbps on mac actually is a limitation of Mac OS. When people boot to Windows using Boot Camp these same macs are capable of 300 mbps.
That's totally insane! I had no idea about this limitation and it boggles my mind why Apple would hamstring wireless in this way. Perhaps Snow Leopard will address and fix this? I very much hope so because this is not cool.
Someone should bring this up to the folks at TekZilla and/or GeekBrief. Perhaps with a little ''bad publicity'' Apple will respond? Maybe post in the Apple tech support forums as well?
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Demonized,
The issue with speeds greater than 130 mbps on mac actually is a limitation of Mac OS. When people boot to Windows using Boot Camp these same macs are capable of 300 mbps. Just wanted to let you know :)
Is anyone sure thats actually a limitation or if its just whats reported.
I have a macbook that was the first macbook that had wireless-n. Its not in front of me, but I am pretty sure that I have my router set to 40only and my macbook and my girlfriends (current generation) both work great with it.
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Have you checked the wireless status page on the Dlink side? I have never gotten anywhere near 300mbps with any macs. Just because your laptop works great doesn't mean you are realizing the full benefit of wireless n.
cmk1198: I did try and throttle down to 20mhz and still got no love.
Went out and bought one of the newly released Belkin gigabit over powerline to bypass the wireless all together. Of course, it seems the outlets I want to use aren't on the same grid so they don't connect. It seems I'm running out of options here. Maybe fish line and two tin cans will work :)
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Lol, well, changing the setting to 20 MHz definitely was not a guaranteed fix, I was sort of hoping that this setting on the router was causing some type of incompatibility. About how far away is the router from your Mini? Maybe changing the beacon period, RTS or fragmentation thresholds would have some effect?
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Have you checked the wireless status page on the Dlink side? I have never gotten anywhere near 300mbps with any macs. Just because your laptop works great doesn't mean you are realizing the full benefit of wireless n.
cmk1198: I did try and throttle down to 20mhz and still got no love.
Went out and bought one of the newly released Belkin gigabit over powerline to bypass the wireless all together. Of course, it seems the outlets I want to use aren't on the same grid so they don't connect. It seems I'm running out of options here. Maybe fish line and two tin cans will work :)
Yeah, I kind of just figured that if the mac didn't supper 40Mhz, that I couldn't set my router to 40only and still have it work without issue.
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I'm going to the Apple store tomorrow with Mac Mini in tow. Let's see what the Genius Bar has to say about this dilemma.
Not to point fingers here, but it's ironic how Apple use to cry foul none stop on Microsoft for forcing users to use their products when they were the little guy. It seems as of late they have taken this play out of the Microsoft book. Itunes exclusivity is a joke and I've heard from numerous people they are now doing the same thing with Macs. 50 bucks says when I bring this thing in it will work flawlessly with an Airport Extreme. Will report back on my findings.
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I'm going to the Apple store tomorrow with Mac Mini in tow. Let's see what the Genius Bar has to say about this dilemma.
Not to point fingers here, but it's ironic how Apple use to cry foul none stop on Microsoft for forcing users to use their products when they were the little guy. It seems as of late they have taken this play out of the Microsoft book. Itunes exclusivity is a joke and I've heard from numerous people they are now doing the same thing with Macs. 50 bucks says when I bring this thing in it will work flawlessly with an Airport Extreme. Will report back on my findings.
FYI, I have been using macs my whole life. I used macs in college on wireless, friend houses, I bring it to work now and use on wireless. I have never had an issue connecting to access points.
This could be a specific problem with your specific mac, but maybe not. I run a dir-825 running 1.01 and a 655 running 1.31 with no mac issues in a mac heavy environment.
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FYI, I have been using macs my whole life. I used macs in college on wireless, friend houses, I bring it to work now and use on wireless. I have never had an issue connecting to access points.
This could be a specific problem with your specific mac, but maybe not. I run a dir-825 running 1.01 and a 655 running 1.31 with no mac issues in a mac heavy environment.
I never said it was a connnection problem. I can connect with no issue but the speeds are terrible on my Mac Mini and my airport express compared to my PCs.
I just got back from the Mac store and guess what??? It connected at 30mbps. Basically they told me it connects fine and I should buy an Airport Extreme becasue it's a better overall router. Is Dlink or Apple to blame?? A much higher pay grade then mine can decide.
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The Apple store recommending an Apple product... imagine that ;D