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The Graveyard - Products No Longer Supported => D-Link Storage => DNS-323 => Topic started by: nwuwvu on July 24, 2010, 09:02:56 AM

Title: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: nwuwvu on July 24, 2010, 09:02:56 AM
Hi everyone, I'm new to this forum and I searched for an answer to my problem but I couldn't find one. I just purchase the DNS-323 and have it networked to my two desktop and one notebook computers. The DNS-323 detects all three computers. On my Windows XP desktop and Vista notebook computers I am able to input the URL for the Scheduled Backup folders/files and when I click the Test button it's succesful. Now, when I enter a URL path for a folder/file I want to backup on my Windows 7 desktop computer, the test fails. I called tech support and was passed onto a Level 3 tech and he could not solve the issue. He was using a computer with Windows XP installed and it works on this platform, but not in Windows 7.

Can someone please tell me the URL path (sequence, order, etc.) that I need to input in the URL box on my Windows 7 computer for the Scheduled Backup to properly work??? Or, is it a firewall or security feature in Windows 7 that needs to be changed??

Thanks for your help.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: fordem on July 24, 2010, 09:49:33 AM
The problem is going to be on the Windows7 side - either the permissions or the firewall.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: k3rnelpanic on July 28, 2010, 03:32:38 PM
What verison of Windows 7 are you using? If it is home premium microsoft has removed the ability to backup to the network. You have to be running Pro or higher.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: tentimes on July 30, 2010, 10:54:49 AM
If you play about with windows 7 networking you will see that it does things a little differently in terms of sharing. I would say the answer is somewhere in the sharing options or under your homegroup options. Are you sure you have everything, including the 323 on the same domain/group name? I have eigth windows 7 machines here and one linux and I know that, for some reason, I have had to go back and set the domain/workgroup more than once on at least 2 machines. At the time of writing I can't recall exactly what the quirk is I'm afraid, but there is one. Hopefully that will be of some help to you :)
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: fordem on July 31, 2010, 05:00:55 AM
What verison of Windows 7 are you using? If it is home premium microsoft has removed the ability to backup to the network. You have to be running Pro or higher.

If I understand the issue at hand, he's not using Windows7 to backup the data to the DNS-323, he's using the DNS-323 to backup the data from the Windows7 system.

This is not just a matter of semantics - it determines which device initiates the backup, and if I'm right and he is using the scheduled backup feature of the DNS-323, all it needs on the Windows7 side of things is access to the files over the network, so as long as Windows7 allows the files to be shared, and the DNS-323 can access them, it will back them up.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: nwuwvu on August 07, 2010, 07:33:15 AM
Thanks for all the replies to my question. Yes, I am using the DNS-323 to backup my data, not Windows 7. I just need Windows 7, somehow, to give permission for the DNS-323 to backup specific files and folders. I double checked and all my computers are on the same workgroup. I am using Windows 7 Home Premium on my desktop, and it is this computer that I cannot backup properly to the DNS-323; however, my Vista Ultimate and Windows XP computers can be backed up by the DNS-323.

I enabled the share features for the specific files and folders that I want to backup to the DNS-323 but the DNS-323 still cannot "see" it. What else should I try??

Thanks for all your help!
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: jamieburchell on August 07, 2010, 08:18:00 AM
In the share properties did you select "Everyone" for at least read access? In Vista you used to be able to turn off password protected sharing too- not sure if that's relevant here. Also make sure file and print sharing is excluded in the firewall rules- or disable the firewall temporarily.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: nwuwvu on August 07, 2010, 10:17:48 AM
Yes, I selected to share with "Everyone" for the files and folders that I want the DNS-323 to backup. I made sure the file and print sharing was excluded from the firewall and the test to backup was still unsuccessful. I even turned off the firewall temporarily as suggested and the test still failed.

Is there anything else I can try to resolve this problem?
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: kdcarver on August 08, 2010, 06:58:26 PM
Yes, I selected to share with "Everyone" for the files and folders that I want the DNS-323 to backup. I made sure the file and print sharing was excluded from the firewall and the test to backup was still unsuccessful. I even turned off the firewall temporarily as suggested and the test still failed.

Is there anything else I can try to resolve this problem?

I'm having similar problems getting Windows 7 Backup and Restore to perform a backup on the DNS-323.  It will recognize the NAS, and start  backup, but it always fails
Suggestions?
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: gunrunnerjohn on August 08, 2010, 07:02:48 PM
Kinda' makes you wonder if you should rethink my advice to move to a better package. :)
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: laving on December 07, 2010, 08:07:17 PM
i have W7 Ent and unfortunately backup doesn't work neither way. not w7->NAS nor NAS->W7.
FW 1.09
all devices are in same workgroup and homegroup. as i have pretty green field no passwords required on any device.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: Moose_On_Roids on January 17, 2011, 03:25:14 PM
I have the same exact problem as the original poster (nwuwvu) - the DNS fails the URL test with correct user and password log in.  Seems like there was no resolution to this for him/her.

I do have an XP laptop that can map a drive to the Win7 desktop share that I am trying to schedule a backup with the DNS.  The user/password used to make this connection on the XP is failing on the DNS url test.  I even tried "WIN7-DESKTOP-COMPUTERNAME\USERNAME" in the user field on the DNS, and that did not work.

The DNS-323 can pass the URL test with my XP laptop shared folder, so I know my DNS does not have an inherit problem with scheduling a backup.

So it seems the problem is not the Win7 desktop as I can map it successfully with the XP.  But then again the DNS seems ok too because it works on the XP.  This is very strange.  Anyone else have this problem or fix?

Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: lookingforinfo on January 17, 2011, 06:28:12 PM
You do not say what software you are using on the Windows 7 machine, but I have been able to use Norton 360 to run scheduled backups on my wife's Win 7 machine.  Using the "Map Network Drive" option I created a drive N: and mapped it using the notation \\dlink-nas1\Volume_1\directory_name.  (dlink-nas1 is the name I assigned to our DNS-323.)  Within Norton 360 I specified N: as the backup location destination.  It seems to work based on the dates associated with the files created on the DNS-323.  Hope this helps.    
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: Moose_On_Roids on January 18, 2011, 09:41:20 AM
I am trying to do the reverse, like the original poster.  I am trying to use the DNS "Download Scheduler" to backup folders on my Win7 desktop.  I can not pass the URL test in the DNS scheduler application.

I am trying to use the DNS scheduler to see if it is quicker than trying to backup Win7 to DNS.  I've tried backing up (mirror copy folders) Win7 to DNS using several programs, but I had experienced exponential slow down in transfer rate (see related link   http://forums.dlink.com/index.php?topic=21216.0).

I know the Win7 desktop is configured correctly for sharing, as my XP laptop is mapped to the folders I am trying to backup to the DNS.  I can also get the DNS to pass the URL test for a folder on my XP laptop.  So everything seems to work fine together except DNS access to Win7. 

To recap... ::)
Win7 --> DNS = OK
Win7 --> XP = OK
XP  --> DNS OK
XP --> Win7 OK
DNS --> XP = OK
DNS -- Win7 = FAIL to connect
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 21, 2012, 02:44:10 AM
So has anyone made progress with this.
Scheduled task work fine to XP or Vista but not to any W7 boxes of mine.
Sharing is properly configured on the W7 boxes
DNS-323 Firmware is 1.10
Thanks
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: fordem on January 21, 2012, 07:34:24 AM
See my first reply.

IF the scheduled back-up is working fine with XP or Vista, the problem WILL be on the W7 box - either your firewall or your permissions.  SOMETHING on the W7 box is denying the NAS access to the data.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 22, 2012, 02:26:33 PM
Very helpful
I keep seeing folks say they have this problem. Ive not seen anyone post that they have it working.
More to the point, I've not seen anyone identify W7 configuring issue and how to resolve it.
I have
3 - Windows7 (2 Ultimates and 1 Enterprise)
1 - Vista (Home Premium)
2 - XP
1 - Solaris/Samba
2 Linksys NSLU2 NAS running V2.3R63-uNSLUng-6.8-beta (pre-Windows7)

All boxes see the W7 share properly
The share is in the ROOT and is called "foo" to prevent complications with long paths in the 323's URL field
The firewall is shutdown
File Sharing Password protection is off
For this share Guest, Administrator, user, and Everyone are allowed users with full control
What else is there?

Also, a buddy who has the next newer version has exact problem
I guess it's netmon time :(

What's really embarassing for the DLINK NAS is that my ancient NSLU2s don't have a problem at all with the W7 boxes and shares doing a backup from NAS.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 22, 2012, 04:57:39 PM
Interesting info from MS NETMON
Setup:
Windows 7 Ultimate  share=\\192.168.1.15\foo
Vista Home Premium share=\\192.168.1.101\pkgs
DLINK 323 NAS Firmware 1.10

* DLINK NAS trying to backup from a remote share using TCP/SMB
* Performed several p-captures of each system to validate consistency
* Setup the Scheduled backup for Folder, Account with credentials

Observation/Interpretation of NETMON Captured packets is interesting

NAS to Vista capture:
So an SMB session is initiated from the NAS advertising a Dialect Negotiation
Vista responds with Dialect Negotiation
NAS then proceeds with Session Setup containing necessary credentials
Vista confirms Session Setup and credentials
NAS issues an SMB TreeConnect containing the path to the share
Vista Confirms TreeConnect
NAS issues TreeDisconnect
Vista Confirms TreeDisconnect
NAS reports TEST SUCCESS via HTTP

NAS to W7 capture:
So an SMB session is initiated from the NAS advertising a Dialect Negotiation
W7 responds with Dialect Negotiation
NAS reports TEST FAILURE via HTTP
No further SMB dialect

So the interesting observation is the NAS to a W7 box never passes Dialect Negotiation
The response packet from Vista and W7 look to be similar but Im no SMB expert
There are interesting TCP packets to port 445, wonder what's happening there??


The NAS doesn't even make it into subsequent SMB transactions. The share nor credentials have even come into play.

Perhaps someone intimate with SMB and Port-445 packet details in the Dialect negotiation phase can comment???

I have the MS NETMON capture files available if someone wants to email me, I'll send.
Thanks for your input



 
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: Steve Pitts on January 23, 2012, 04:03:44 AM
Perhaps someone intimate with SMB and Port-445 packet details in the Dialect negotiation phase can comment???
Well I don't fall into that category, but I've just tried this on my DNS323 and it worked first time.

I provided explicit credentials and a UNC name that I checked from one of my Windows XP boxes.

The Windows 7 box is running 64 bit Windows 7 Pro and is not set up to use HomeGroups, just uses a standard Workgroup name used by all the systems on my home network.

Now obviously none of the above is particularly useful, so you may be wondering why I bothered posting?? Well, it occurs to me that this might be related to LanMan authentication, which is something that I tweaked not long after getting the DNS323 on the basis of this document:

Troubleshooting: Connecting Windows Vista to shared drives and folders (ftp://files.dlink.com.au/products/DNS-323/REV_B/SetupGuides/Troubleshooting_-_Connecting_Vista_PC_to_network_drives.pdf)

It advertises itself as applying to Vista, but it made a difference to the reliability of my connections from Windows 7 to the other systems in my network (two Windows XP boxes as well as the NAS). What is it set to on your Windows 7 system (if running a Home edition you'll need to use Regedit rather than secpol)??
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: fordem on January 23, 2012, 04:37:40 AM
Very helpful
I keep seeing folks say they have this problem. Ive not seen anyone post that they have it working.
More to the point, I've not seen anyone identify W7 configuring issue and how to resolve it.
I have
3 - Windows7 (2 Ultimates and 1 Enterprise)
1 - Vista (Home Premium)
2 - XP
1 - Solaris/Samba
2 Linksys NSLU2 NAS running V2.3R63-uNSLUng-6.8-beta (pre-Windows7)

All boxes see the W7 share properly
The share is in the ROOT and is called "foo" to prevent complications with long paths in the 323's URL field
The firewall is shutdown
File Sharing Password protection is off
For this share Guest, Administrator, user, and Everyone are allowed users with full control
What else is there?

Also, a buddy who has the next newer version has exact problem
I guess it's netmon time :(

What's really embarassing for the DLINK NAS is that my ancient NSLU2s don't have a problem at all with the W7 boxes and shares doing a backup from NAS.

What can I say - I DON"T have it - I can tell you that it lies on the Win 7 end though

1 x W7-32
2 x W7-64
1 x Vista
? X WXP Pro
1 X W2K3
1 X W2K8

Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 23, 2012, 05:30:41 AM
Hmm, one of the w7's was already set per this document and the other was not set to anything.
Changing that particular policy setting made no difference.
But you well may be correct that its something in NTLM
Still researching, thanks for your input
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 23, 2012, 06:31:10 AM
Well, went back and turned on NTLM auditing and adjusted NTLM settings on one of the W7 boxes per
http://developers.de/blogs/damir_dobric/archive/2009/08/16/enabling-of-ntlm-on-windows-7-and-windows-server-2008-r2.aspx

See other NTLM events when other systems access the share on this W7 box, NO EVENTS when the NAS tries to access.

No joy in mudville  :'(
I'm sure I will feel silly once I stumble on the solution, just feeling very frustrated at the moment.
Perhaps I'll call DLINK Tech Support, that should be an adventure.

Any other thoughts are appreciated
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 23, 2012, 01:02:57 PM
Spent over 115 minutes working with DLINK tech support and they couldn't make it work either even remoting into one of my W7 boxes using teamviewer.
At my current billing rate I've expending well over 3 times this products value and the manufacturer can't make it work giving them full control of the Windows7 box.
Supposedly this case is being escalated to a Network Engineer.
Supposedly a troubleshooting document is to be posted in reply to this thread with tips for me to follow
The saga slowly drags on
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: egarcia on January 23, 2012, 01:06:15 PM
Hi Rob,

Try this one http://www.petri.co.il/disable-uac-in-windows-7.htm

Thank you
Ellie
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 23, 2012, 01:19:25 PM
Ellie,
I thoroughly reviewed that link and I question its applicability. Disabling UAC is something I would have to think very long and hard upon and I feel is an unreasonable request for a device manufacturer to make.
I still feel it is encumbent upon the manufacturer to provide resolution.
To date, this has not been the case.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 24, 2012, 11:04:05 AM
I received the infamous call from Tier-3 Network Engineer John
He flatly indicated that per D-LINK's advice UAC must be disabled on the W7 boxes before their NAS will work properly with a scheduled backup access to a Windows 7 share.

This is absolutely unacceptable as UAC is critical in protection of the OS and components and to ask a customer to turn it off is ludicrous and poses a substantial security risk.

I will reiterate that the following systems have no issues whatsoever accessing the Windows7 shares
Solaris/Samba
XP-Pro
Windows7 Enterprise
Windows7 Ultimate
Windows7 Pro
Linksys NAS (two) (these perform scheduled backups to windows7 shares without issues)
Kindle Fire - Using ES File Explorer

DLINK's stance that disabling UAC is unacceptable from this customer's perspective.
This is poor and unacceptable customer support.


Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 24, 2012, 01:04:52 PM
To Clarify, for newcomers, I'm attempting to use the DNS-323 APPLICATION Scheduled Backup feature and DLINK cannot assist me to make it work. To add further clarity or information, John from DLINK tech support was supposed to follow-up to our phone call by posting his advice to this forum. I see that he is "johnny-on-the-spot" with that task. Also, telling me that I should open a ticket with Microsoft is ludicrous from a supposedly "Tier-3 Networking Engineer".
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 24, 2012, 01:34:54 PM
The DLINK DNS-325 Exhibits the exact problems
Removing DLINK from my list of acceptable Vendors
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: fordem on January 24, 2012, 02:52:07 PM
See other NTLM events when other systems access the share on this W7 box, NO EVENTS when the NAS tries to access.

Firewall blocking them?  The other alternative is the NAS not sending them.

Are you by any chance using a "home group"?
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 24, 2012, 03:03:14 PM
FYI
Firewall is turned OFF
Homegroup Sharing is OFF - NO Homegroup is defined

As a followup talking with Microsoft contacts, they STRONGLY are against disabling UAC. Comments are that it is protecting the OS and is not involved at the level the NAS is trying to access.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: Steve Pitts on January 25, 2012, 12:00:30 AM
UAC must be disabled on the W7 boxes before their NAS will work properly with a scheduled backup access to a Windows 7 share
FWIW that isn't the case for me. I have UAC enabled (in the default configuration of 'Always notify') and the account that I used in the parameters to the 'Scheduled Download' does not have administrator rights. I fully agree with your position on not disabling UAC and would take the same stance myself.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 25, 2012, 03:40:12 AM
Steve, thanks for the reply
Yup, the UAC bit was a "shot in the dark" I'm afraid.
You did trigger some thoughts on additional testing though, still no Joy
Here's the additional testing:

Created a new user account (non-priveleged) added it to the share with FULL control
TEST FAILED
Booted W7 box in SAFE-MODE with NETWORKING tried several user accounts
TESTS FAILED

Here is what is shown by net share on my w7 Ultimate
C:\Windows\system32>net share foo
Share name        foo
Path              C:\foo
Remark
Maximum users     No limit
Users
Caching           Manual caching of documents
Permission        Everyone, FULL
                  BUILTIN\Administrators, FULL
                  rob-HP\bkup, FULL

another W7 share on W7-Pro
C:\Windows\system32>net share mp3
Share name        mp3
Path              C:\mp3
Remark
Maximum users     No limit
Users
Caching           Manual caching of documents
Permission        Everyone, FULL
                  BUILTIN\Administrators, FULL
                  Gator\Guest, FULL

Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: Steve Pitts on January 28, 2012, 04:49:03 AM
Created a new user account (non-priveleged) added it to the share with FULL control
Assuming that you're using NTFS that isn't good enough on its own, what are the permissions on the disk structure?? You can view that information from the Security tab of the Properties dialog for any given entity on disk or by using a tool like Sysinternals' AccessChk
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 28, 2012, 05:13:42 AM
NTFS permissions (Security TAB on folder being shared) have each account, including Everyone and Guest as full control for the purpose of this testing.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: Steve Pitts on January 29, 2012, 06:41:34 AM
Sorry sir, I'm all out of ideas :(
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: digitaldias on January 31, 2012, 06:21:45 AM
This is so amateurish from Dlink that I will loudly recommend against buying their products on twitter and facebook. GEESH, how badly do you have to suck!?

Workaround:

Create a new text file named "DailyBackup.bat"
inside it, write the following:

Code: [Select]
SET DlinkFolder=\\MyDlinkDrive\Volume_1

RoboCopy /S /XO D:\Images %DlinkFolder%\Images
RoboCopy /S /XO D:\Documents %DlinkFolder%\Documents
RoboCopy /S /XO D:\Movies %DlinkFolder%\Movies

Save that file, now you can SCHEDULE that file to run i.e. every night. Obviously, you need to change the folder names on source and destination to match your needs, however, this works fairly painlessly.
Title: Re: DNS-323 and Windows 7 Scheduled Backup Problem
Post by: n5btr on January 31, 2012, 02:36:22 PM
Folks,
Thanks for the input and suggestions.
I no longer am attempting to use the device to perform the functions as DLINK cannot make it work.
I have two other NAS that perform this task quite nicely thank you.

Appreciate everyone's help and suggestions
Thanks very much